Dear all,

another question, this time about vehicles with ATGM and other main weapons. In the vehicle stats I see three qualifiers that relate to this; eg. Marder cannot fire main gun and ATGM in same activation/reaction; BMP/BMD cannot fire main gun and ATGM at same time; and Bradley cannot fire main gun and ATGW in same turn (though Bradley in Cold War Gone Hot states activation/reaction, presumably a change due to difference in relative performance compared to other contemporary vehicles). I presume this is due to them having one-man turrets, problems in reloading, or firing the weapons (eg the Marder requires the commander to be unbuttoned to fore the ATGM). And the supplement states that vehicle mounted ATGMs can only be fired once per turn.

If one assumes that this apparent inconsistency of language is deliberate, and the phrases do mean different things, can I interpret the rules as meaning something along the following lines, eg;
• Marder cannot fire both its main 20mm gun and ATGW weapon in any one activation/reaction. So it can fire one or the other of these two in a firing activation, or in a response to a reaction by the non-initiative player (or vice versa), plus its MG, can only fire its ATGW once in a turn, but can fire the 20mm gun and MG multiple times in any one turn (the turn being the activations/reactions of the initiative player and any by the non-initiative player, so a series of activations/reactions).
• The BMP/BMD cannot fire its main 30mm gun and ATGM turret mounted weapon at the same time. So it can fire one or the other, plus its MG, can only fire its ATGW once per turn, but can fire the 30mm gun and MG multiple times in a turn. This to me has the same effect as the Marder example, so not sure what difference is intended.
• The Bradley seems to be limited more severely, in that it cannot fire its main gun and ATGW in the same turn. So it can fire its main gun and MG each activation/reaction, or its ATGW and MG in an activation/reaction, but can only fire its ATGW once in a turn. If it fires with its 25mm gun, or ATGW, it cannot then fire the other in any other activation/reaction during that turn. This seems to mean that the Bradley can scoot around blasting away with its 25mm gun and MG multiple times, but cannot fire its ATGW if it does so. Or it can decide that it really wants to fire its ATGW that turn, in which case it can do so once, and it sacrifices the use of its 25mm gun for the whole turn, but could still use its MG.
• And as all these ATGMs are SACLOS/MCLOS, the vehicles cannot move if they want to fire them, or move if they have fired them.
Is that right, and what is the intended difference between the Marder and BMP/BMD qualifiers?

Many thanks (again).

Malcolm

Malcom
in the case of the soviet platforms one man turrets played a part and later when the BMP3 series its a factor that both doctrine and weapons intergration.
The Marder 1 can not fire his ATGM or main gun in the same reaction and has to reload exposed. again plays a role in statting out this vehicle.
The Brad again 2 missiles and forced to reload you have to turn the turret so the luancher is over the cargo crew hatch tilt it up and slide in and conect the reloads do a quick diagnostic and then reorient the luancher and turret and reenter the fight hopefully from a hide position not exposed to fire ...So both Human and weapons interface as well as doctrine play a part also remember that at that time firing a ATGM was both Noisy and messy (smoke trails) and everyone was trained to engage the guys that fired in hopes of them losing trackwhile the target vehicle poped smoke and tried to evade....So the Brad may fire either the 25mm and MGs per Action/ reaction with the normal restrictions or fire his TOW Once per turn then fire his MGs (Coax) each action /reaction that turn.

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"All Men for the rights of Every man, every man for the rights of all Men"

Thanks for the response, it makes more sense now! Like another set of rules I use, Field of Battle (Piquet), you get some odd rules or situations that develop, but if you can compare them to what might happen in reality, they do actually make sense.

Thanks again, and we have our demo game this weekend, so will no doubt have more question then.

Cheers

Malc

Malc , You want to keep the Mg's , cannons etc shooting at Infantry , LAV's and soft skins ..

If u see an MBT , u avoid it all costs or keep still and fire your AT Missile at it .

Stone , Paper , Scissors as Sheldon would say .

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'' I love my models , they are made of swiss cheese ''

Also Malk
if you want you guys to be able to fire ATGM and Main gun go ahead we wont shoot ya ....Mikey

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"All Men for the rights of Every man, every man for the rights of all Men"