Hey,

I'm going to play the Knife Fight scenario out of the FoF book this Saturday. I noticed there aren't any specific stats for the T72s involved...however, in the vehicle reference tables there are stats for the T72MB,

So...I should be using the T72M stats (minus the ATGM) correct? Did the Iraqi T72Ms use ERA? The armor ratings would be the same across the board for the T72B or T72M, the difference being the use of the ATGM and/or ERA?

I guess the ERA is a mute point since the Abrams aren't firing missiles correct?

Thanks! Just trying to get a handle on things...
Brian

_________________
Thanks!


GOD BLESS!
Brian

Can't say on the ATGM - since I'm building an Iraqi army, I was kinda hoping I'd get them but await the word of others. On the ERA, I've not seen any photos of Iraqi T-72s with it. I'm leaving it off of mine for the time being. I've put together unit cards based on what I could see in photos on this forum from other members, and searched the web for good photos of undamaged T-72s to use on the T-72 card. Found lots of good images out there, and again, not one has ERA on it. I'm preparing to run that scenario soon in 1/285th scale, but it's also being run at Cincycon a week from tomorrow, and naturally I wont be there for the Friday evening event.

Tom Oxley

_________________
Tom Oxley
OD Green Old Fart
FoF: RtB, EF, AV, CWGH, DotR, BW, DMA, Fal, C-SOM, SOG

Even if they did use ERA, it's only effective (game purposes) against missiles correct? It wouldn't be helpful against an enemy tank's main gun...am I understanding that correctly?

I *might* try to get up some stat cards as well...that would be a GREAT idea!


Thanks!

_________________
Thanks!


GOD BLESS!
Brian

Brian,

Use the T-72 stats from Appendix 4.

Since ERA, as you say, only protects against some missiles I wouldnt worry about it.

A quick google search didnt turn up any pictures with T-72 in Iraqi service sporting ERA from this period. However, as I said, it was a quick search and someone with more knowledge of the period and subject matter could set us both straight.

As an interesting aside. None of the models available out there of T-72 in Iraqi service have ERA so that might tell us something.

I will keep looking and do a little research. If I find something different I will come back and post some links to it.

Edited to add:

I did stat cards for my con game and it really helped. I printed them all on a page turned "landscape" and then on the other side were the damage tables we would be using in the game. No pictures but I figure folks playing in my game knew what HUMVEEs and LAV-25 were.

_________________
Budda impressionist for hire, inquire within.

I think your right. Might make a difference when I get a scenario put together for Kuwaiti TOWs vs my Iraqi T-72 and BMPs. If your able to work with MS Word 07 files, drop me a line at thomaso827 AT sbcglobal.net and I'll pass them along. Print on card stock or paper, black and white or color. I have a set made up for this scenario to be able to keep track of damage that would not be visible. I plan to keep them in document protectors and mark with dry erase pens. 4 tank cards to a sheet. If you can work with the MS software, you can modify them to anything you want, just type in the different data, change the photo, etc. It's what I do with a slow day at the office.

Tom Oxley

_________________
Tom Oxley
OD Green Old Fart
FoF: RtB, EF, AV, CWGH, DotR, BW, DMA, Fal, C-SOM, SOG

Thanks guys!

I'll send an email shortly!

From what I gather, it looks like the T-72B has an ATGM launcher, while the M model doesn't, the M model is the one in Iraqi service, if I'm understanding correctly.

This is all from quick searches...nothing terribly in depth...

Thanks!

_________________
Thanks!


GOD BLESS!
Brian

During the run up I never saw any T-72s with ERA , and there where at least ten abandoned on the road to Al HILLAA and none had ERA....Mikey

_________________
"All Men for the rights of Every man, every man for the rights of all Men"

The GHQ T-72M has a tube on the back of the turret. Been away from threat recognition training way too long I suppose, but I thought that tube was a part of a fording kit, that the ATGM on this model was fired through the gun tube. Either would explain not being able to fire both at the same time. This is an opportunity for me to learn something new as we go over this.

Tom Oxley

_________________
Tom Oxley
OD Green Old Fart
FoF: RtB, EF, AV, CWGH, DotR, BW, DMA, Fal, C-SOM, SOG

99.9 % sure the iraqi's were never supplied with T72 tube launched missiles .

also no ERA versions were sold to Iraq .

Iraq had some Gill armour T72's which u can see in the streets of Kuwait city in 91 ..

_________________
'' I love my models , they are made of swiss cheese ''

I'm assuming they don't have ERA based on what I'm gathering ya'll...the stat line in the book combines the T72 B and M models I think.

The notes in the FoF appendix state that the ATGM and the Main Gun can be fired in the same turn...however, I don't have my book in front of me (at work.... ) I'll check when I get home!



Thanks!
Brian

_________________
Thanks!


GOD BLESS!
Brian

Thanks!

I'll go with that!

Hijacking my own thread...the M1A1 was the primary tank for the Gulf War 2 wasn't it?

_________________
Thanks!


GOD BLESS!
Brian

I stand corrected, I think, the M1A2 was the primary tank of Gulf War 2...right?

_________________
Thanks!


GOD BLESS!
Brian

GOOD GRIEF! I stand corrected AGAIN...AND I can't read or I need glasses, the ATGM and the Main Gun CAN'T be fired in the same turn! I checked in the Motor Pool spread sheet....



sheesh...my bad....

_________________
Thanks!


GOD BLESS!
Brian

Brian its all good.

I have thought that this would be an interesting scenario to play. Just never had the vehicles to pull it off. Please post us up an ARR wtih lots of pics. Otherwise I will have Mikey break out the meat thong on vacation to Pensacola this summer when you host the first annual AAG house party and adult beverage bash. No, seriously its awsome of you to do that.

_________________
Budda impressionist for hire, inquire within.

To further reinforce please note the folowing
Restrictions on vehicle fire.
Page 78 Main FOF rule book : Most AFvs have more weapons then crew members to fire them.
.....as a rule of thumb a vehicle may fire its main gun and one secondary system on a single turn...Mikey

_________________
"All Men for the rights of Every man, every man for the rights of all Men"